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34 minutes ago, Mitch McDeere said:

Plebes, the site was down one morning this week.  Did you panic?  Did you have someone's digits to whom you could make your promise?  I know the site came back up later in the day, but promises are made early, no excuses.  

I know it is weird, but make sure as a plebe you have some method of making a promise and being held accountable if the site goes down or you lose power or your phone dies.  Quit doesn't suffer excuses.

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PLEBES:

Quitting dip has something to do with living in the present moment. The present never changes, it's always right now, it's outside of time in a sense because time is often defined as a measure of change and the present does not change. Sometimes people say that living for the moment means you can do whatever you want and not worry about consequences, unquit people use this as an excuse all the time; but the act of dipping ejects a person from the present moment because dip is used in order to produce a change, physically and/or mentally. So dipping makes it not possible to live in the present. You can always refer back to the unchanging present, in the same way that as quit we can always refer to the quit which is timeless and unchanging, yet also fully present in each moment.

Edit- and Stephen Hawking says there are two dimensions of time. (RIP)

Edited by QuitSpeak

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On 3/21/2018 at 8:16 PM, redrabbit said:

Obviously I'm not the quitting expert. But I always thought of someone saying that they're an addict alleviates some responsibility for the action; they could say "oh well I broke down and started again because I'm an addict I can't help it". I don't want to think of myself as an addict; I'm a person who chose (for a long time) to use tobacco and am now choosing to stop using it. 

redrabbit 

I've been thinking about this since you wrote it.  I think it's important.  The "victim" aspect of the addict title is off-putting to me as well.  It is to all of us.  The main thing that defines QD is that we're not victims.  We accept responsibility and accountability.

But if you're not an addict, that means you weren't addicted.  Or, if you were an addict and you're not anymore, you're "cured" and you don't need to post ever day.

For a long time I thought I had to stop using to prove to myself that I wasn't addicted to nicotine.  I promised myself in the mirror thousands of times that I was done - last night was my last dip.  Turns out making a promise to that useless asshole was meaningless.  Which is why it never worked.  I was a "light user" in terms of frequency too.  That doesn't matter.  There's so much fucking nicotine in dip that there's no such thing as a "light user." I finally realized that I had to admit that I was addicted - admit that I AM an addict, and always will be - in order to become quit.

That realization pissed me off.  I'm still mad and always will be that I was a dumb, pussy-bitch, asshole-shit-bag that chose to use over and over again.  I messed up my brain.  I missed lots of time with friends and family.  I shortened my life span.  But now I'm quit.  Now every morning when I post I think, "fucking asshole...never again."

Acknowledging that I'm an addict doesn't let me off the hook, it places me firmly on it.  I chose to become addicted to nicotine by using it.  Now I choose to be quit by posting my promise here every damn day (EDD) until I die.

@Lee @Mizzip @House @Quit4life @EmilyDarline @Wingmaster - what do you all think?

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8 hours ago, Dirty Randy said:

Owl nailed it, but I would like to add that to me, I think you can have multiple definitions of the word "addict."

1.) Oh, poor me, I'm addicted and can't help it, I have to keep dipping!

2.) Yeah, I was addicted to dip, but I finally found my ball sack and quit like a real man, so I just accept that I made a choice to become an addict, and I'm now working on correcting that. 

(DR - moved these to the right thread)

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In one of my past lives, I locked up addicts for a living. Hundreds of them. I showed up at a hearing and recommended they go to prison which they almost always did. Their addiction wasn't dip. It was usually meth, pharmaceuticals, heroin or occassionally cocaine.  Their arguments and excuses were exactly the same. We're addicts,  "thats what we do" we use. 

Legally, that defense rarely worked. Being educated and trained in the revocation of addicted criminals, we used the term "assuming or taking a victim stance".  The addict loves the word "relapse" and uses that term to soften using in attempt to incorporate continued use into their "recovery". 

The bottom line is an addiction is the use of a substance when stopping is no longer  an option without withdrawl and over time it takes more of that substance to achieve the same results.  Everything from lying to cheating to commiting crimes to feed that addiction is part of the process.  Addicts supporting  addicts in recovery is a good thing.  Addicts making excuses for their actions and behaviors hurt themselves and everyone around them.   

I to am an addict.  I can not control how much dip I use. The only control I have is not to use, every day, with those here who refuse to be victims. 

 

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1 hour ago, Owl said:

redrabbit 

I've been thinking about this since you wrote it.  I think it's important.  The "victim" aspect of the addict title is off-putting to me as well.  It is to all of us.  The main thing that defines QD is that we're not victims.  We accept responsibility and accountability.

But if you're not an addict, that means you weren't addicted.  Or, if you were an addict and you're not anymore, you're "cured" and you don't need to post ever day.

For a long time I thought I had to stop using to prove to myself that I wasn't addicted to nicotine.  I promised myself in the mirror thousands of times that I was done - last night was my last dip.  Turns out making a promise to that useless asshole was meaningless.  Which is why it never worked.  I was a "light user" in terms of frequency too.  That doesn't matter.  There's so much fucking nicotine in dip that there's no such thing as a "light user." I finally realized that I had to admit that I was addicted - admit that I AM an addict, and always will be - in order to become quit.

That realization pissed me off.  I'm still mad and always will be that I was a dumb, pussy-bitch, asshole-shit-bag that chose to use over and over again.  I messed up my brain.  I missed lots of time with friends and family.  I shortened my life span.  But now I'm quit.  Now every morning when I post I think, "fucking asshole...never again."

Acknowledging that I'm an addict doesn't let me off the hook, it places me firmly on it.  I chose to become addicted to nicotine by using it.  Now I choose to be quit by posting my promise here every damn day (EDD) until I die.

@Lee @Mizzip @House @Quit4life @EmilyDarline @Wingmaster - what do you all think?

I spent thousands of dollars...on voice lessons. Then I damaged my lungs by smoking, which also cost me thousands of dollars. I stood outside of my house in negative degree temps, or with cold rain or snow coming down on me because I desperately needed a cigarette. I hacked through bronchitis and still justified ensuring I had a smoke whenever my body told me it was time for one. I often chose cigarettes over gas or groceries when I was younger. I made my great grandmother ride to a cousin's wedding in someone else's car because of my little secret, losing out on quality time with her and making her feel unimportant thanks to my lousy excuse. That was ten years ago and it still hurts me that I did that.

 Could I have helped it? Not in any of those given moments. I was a victim of my own choices by allowing myself to become an addict. It was my responsibility to refrain from smoking in the first place and I didn't despite knowing better. Because of that, I became a victim of addiction and may someday have cancer for it. I don't beat myself up for failing my quit attempts so many times. Instead, I give myself major credit every day for having kept it up this long, the longest time ever. I am mad at myself for starting. That's where the bulk of my responsibility lies. But I can't change that. I also know that a person who isn't a victim wouldn't put up with what I put myself through, such as trading hands as each of them became numb while smoking outside in the cold because frostbite is worth the fix to an addict. That should really indicate the power of addiction. I didn't think I could ever quit after failing so many times. I'm not about to devalue the power of addiction or hate on myself now. Yesterday, I had to walk through a wall of someone else's smoke. It smelled amazing. I didn't cave. Not about to hate myself right now. Maybe I will be able to afford that luxury when I reach the levels of quit some of you guys have, but not today when I need all the positive reinforcement I can get from myself. 

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@Owl I for sure was addicted. I guess the main sign of that was that not using caused physiological changes. My biggest regret about dipping is mainly what I didn't do because of it. Along the same lines as @EmilyDarline, I would avoid people to use. I was very secretive about dipping, and not many people knew I did it. I couldn't count how many times I gave up doing something with another person to spend time with tobacco; leaving a girlfriends place to go home, blowing off social invitations, showing up late to pack that last one in. I was a low frequency user, but in some ways I think that exacerbated the problems I mentioned. 

My thought process was, "get this stuff done, finish your work, then go home and pack one in". So anything that wasn't a necessity would get blown off, which meant anything that didn't give me money. @Owl and @Lee you make some good points regarding addicts. I avoided the label because I didn't want to be able to use the "relapse" defense. I was an addict, but I don't want to use it present tense because it's something I'm changing. I do have an addiction, but the addiction is not stronger than I am. And like @Dirty Randy said, I did choose to become an addict, but now I'm correcting that. The little devil sitting on my shoulder saying "come on, just do one...it's not a big deal" will soon starve to death and be forgotten. 

Edited by redrabbit

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I had no problem labeling myself an addict from the beginning. I didn't like being an addict, and once I realized I was one, I felt like I'd failed myself. You know, the kid who graduated the Dare program and the one who begged her mother to stop smoking. Couldn't do that anymore without being a hippocrite...It wasn't a tragic feeling, considering all of that was paired with the good feelings my new found friends (cigarettes) gave me. So I accepted it, hoping I'd be strong enough to quit one day. 

Edited by EmilyDarline

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This is really good conversation going on in here, but that ^ romancing cigarettes needs to stop. They were not your friends. They fucked up your lungs and compromised your immune system. Those "good feelings?" That was your neurons in your brain becoming compromised and your nervous system changing because of a toxic, foreign chemical. You're on the right track, Emily. But you don't miss cigarettes. They did nothing for you. They were not your friends. They shortened your lifespan. They took time from your loved ones. They stole from your purse. Keep in mind all that you have lost to cigarettes. I promise it's a lot more than any "good feeling" is ever worth. 

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Randy, you misunderstand me. At the time, that was where I was. I was romancing cigarettes. That is my truth. I don't miss cigarettes all the time anymore. For a second yesterday, I did. Cancer causing, money & time stealing cigarettes. But it was just for a second. I kept walking to finish what I was doing with no question that I would remain a quitter despite that aluring smell. That's huge for me. I think refusing to be honest with myself would be detrimental to the quitting process. I think you see me as glorifying them. That they have the power to turn someone into that kind of a slave is sick. I won't make light of the power of nicotine, as it applies to me today and as it owned me when I smoked. 

Edited by EmilyDarline

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There's nothing wrong with using the word addict.  It makes it more badass when you overcome being one.  Pretending to be cured or that you are no longer addicted is a recipe for disaster.

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12 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

Randy, you misunderstand me. At the time, that was where I was. I was romancing cigarettes. That is my truth. I don't miss cigarettes all the time anymore. For a second yesterday, I did. Cancer causing, money & time stealing cigarettes. But it was just for a second. I kept walking to finish what I was doing with no question that I would remain a quitter despite that aluring smell. That's huge for me. I think refusing to be honest with myself would be detrimental to the quitting process. I think you see me as glorifying them for some reason. No. That they have the power to turn someone into that kind of a slave is sick. But I won't make light of the power of nicotine. 

On your way to a new honesty.

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1 hour ago, EmilyDarline said:

Randy, you misunderstand me. At the time, that was where I was. I was romancing cigarettes. That is my truth. I don't miss cigarettes all the time anymore. For a second yesterday, I did. Cancer causing, money & time stealing cigarettes. But it was just for a second. I kept walking to finish what I was doing with no question that I would remain a quitter despite that aluring smell. That's huge for me. I think refusing to be honest with myself would be detrimental to the quitting process. I think you see me as glorifying them. That they have the power to turn someone into that kind of a slave is sick. I won't make light of the power of nicotine, as it applies to me today and as it owned me when I smoked. 

Those are the kind of realizations that lay the cornerstones of solid quit. You're to the point where these victories are going to start piling up. Bask in every one of them, and then move on to the next and do it again. 

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2 hours ago, EmilyDarline said:

Yesterday, I had to walk through a wall of someone else's smoke. It smelled amazing. I didn't cave. Not about to hate myself right now. Maybe I will be able to afford that luxury when I reach the levels of quit some of you guys have, but not today when I need all the positive reinforcement I can get from myself. 

The idea that by not caving due to “an amazing smell” was self motivation and not romancing is a stretch.  No one here is trying to beat up or tear down anyone for expressing their thoughts or feelings.  Our goal is not for new quitters to hate themselves for being confused or uneducated about quit.  It is our responsibility to point out addict speak and help change the focus from someone who thinks they’re missing out on something as opposed to embracing the freedom of being quit.  

I like this group of newer quitters.  I hang my hat on the fact I will never forget I’m addicted to nicotine and cannot have one because I’m on the scroll first thing everyday.  My daily promise and being active here keeps me quit.

One day there will be a new quitter show up.  He will say all the stuff we all said, and will have some addict speak too.  You will recognize it immediately and they it will become more clear what we do here.  

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Cigarettes fucking stink.  

It's among the most disgusting, offensive smells on Earth... to anyone except a nicotine addict lying to herself. 

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.

Edited by Golf

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10 hours ago, Lipi said:

Cigarettes fucking stink.  

It's among the most disgusting, offensive smells on Earth... to anyone except a nicotine addict lying to herself. 

Explain

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18 hours ago, Owl said:

redrabbit 

I've been thinking about this since you wrote it.  I think it's important.  The "victim" aspect of the addict title is off-putting to me as well.  It is to all of us.  The main thing that defines QD is that we're not victims.  We accept responsibility and accountability.

But if you're not an addict, that means you weren't addicted.  Or, if you were an addict and you're not anymore, you're "cured" and you don't need to post ever day.

For a long time I thought I had to stop using to prove to myself that I wasn't addicted to nicotine.  I promised myself in the mirror thousands of times that I was done - last night was my last dip.  Turns out making a promise to that useless asshole was meaningless.  Which is why it never worked.  I was a "light user" in terms of frequency too.  That doesn't matter.  There's so much fucking nicotine in dip that there's no such thing as a "light user." I finally realized that I had to admit that I was addicted - admit that I AM an addict, and always will be - in order to become quit.

That realization pissed me off.  I'm still mad and always will be that I was a dumb, pussy-bitch, asshole-shit-bag that chose to use over and over again.  I messed up my brain.  I missed lots of time with friends and family.  I shortened my life span.  But now I'm quit.  Now every morning when I post I think, "fucking asshole...never again."

Acknowledging that I'm an addict doesn't let me off the hook, it places me firmly on it.  I chose to become addicted to nicotine by using it.  Now I choose to be quit by posting my promise here every damn day (EDD) until I die.

@Lee @Mizzip @House @Quit4life @EmilyDarline @Wingmaster - what do you all think?

That right there is some sweet sweet quit music. Owl, drop the mic my brother, you just lit the quit stage on fire!!!!!!

Plebes, in my opinion, until you get to this point, until you can say that you were at your bottom, you couldn't go any further and you can say that you despise nic with every fiber of your being, you won't be quit and you definitely won't stay stopped.

 

17 hours ago, EmilyDarline said:

I don't beat myself up for failing my quit attempts so many times. Instead, I give myself major credit every day for having kept it up this long, the longest time ever.

You give yourself major credit?  For being stopped for 46 days?  When you speak of "alluring smells" "smelled amazing" even if it was for "just a second" You've accomplished nothing. You have not only left that door unlocked, you have left that door wide open. Your ship is not burnt as some like to say. The slightest romancing for the poison that controlled you is saying that IT is still in charge! Read what I said above. EVERY spec, every fiber, you HAVE to despise it that much. Myself, 1424 days quit, I have accomplished not a damn thing, nothing. These other folks here, 1500 +, 2000+ days quit, they too have accomplished nothing, if we EVER even for the slightest millisecond think to ourselves that, "it smelled amazing" 

 

 

16 hours ago, EmilyDarline said:

I don't miss cigarettes all the time anymore. For a second yesterday, I did. Cancer causing, money & time stealing cigarettes. But it was just for a second. I kept walking to finish what I was doing with no question that I would remain a quitter despite that aluring smell.

 

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19 hours ago, EmilyDarline said:

 Yesterday, I had to walk through a wall of someone else's smoke. It smelled amazing.

^ romancing 

15 hours ago, Lipi said:

Cigarettes fucking stink.  

It's among the most disgusting, offensive smells on Earth.

^ quit. @EmilyDarline observe the difference. 

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40 minutes ago, Joe Quitter said:

^ romancing 

^ quit. @EmilyDarline observe the difference. 

Honesty - how I felt in that moment. Not going to lie to myself. But I meant explain how I am lying to myself. @Lipi

Edited by EmilyDarline

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It's interesting. The group requires accountability, but when I hold myself accountable, it's viewed as being dishonest. I kind of feel like the rule of the group is to only rely in the accountability of the group, no outside resources or even yourself. 

You can say I'm romancing cigarettes because I said the smoke smelled good to me. To say it smelled disgusting to me, someone who's enjoyed the smell since childhood thanks to my parents' addictions, would be lying. And you can say that, to have enjoyed the smell the month and a half into being a quitter indicates that I'm somehow failing. (You know, because I must have told myself to like the that smell on the way into the library on Saturday.) I don't want to tell my story just to have my honesty mocked. That's not what I'm here for and if that means I don't belong in this group, that's okay too.  

Edited by EmilyDarline

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3 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

It's interesting. The group requires accountability, but when I hold myself accountable, it's viewed as being dishonest. I kind of feel like the rule of the group is to only rely in the accountability of the group, no outside resources or even yourself. 

You can say I'm romancing cigarettes because I said the smoke smelled good to me. To say it smelled disgusting to me, someone who's enjoyed the smell since childhood thanks to my parents' addictions, would be lying. And you can say that, to have enjoyed the smell the month and a half into being a quitter indicates that I'm somehow failing. (You know, because I must have told myself to like the that smell on the way into the library on Saturday.) I don't want to tell my story just to have my honesty mocked. That's not what I'm here for and if that means I don't belong in this group, that's okay too.  

Post scroll

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8 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

It's interesting. The group requires accountability, but when I hold myself accountable, it's viewed as being dishonest. I kind of feel like the rule of the group is to only rely in the accountability of the group, no outside resources or even yourself. 

You can say I'm romancing cigarettes because I said the smoke smelled good to me. To say it smelled disgusting to me, someone who's enjoyed the smell since childhood thanks to my parents' addictions, would be lying. And you can say that, to have enjoyed the smell the month and a half into being a quitter indicates that I'm somehow failing. (You know, because I must have told myself to like the that smell on the way into the library on Saturday.) I don't want to tell my story just to have my honesty mocked. That's not what I'm here for and if that means I don't belong in this group, that's okay too.  

It's not dishonest. It's just not quit.

You are looking for excuses to go back. 

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2 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

It's interesting. The group demands accountability, but when I hold myself accountable, it's viewed as being dishonest. I kind of feel like the rule of the group is to only rely in the accountability of the group, no outside resources or even yourself. 

You can say I'm romancing cigarettes because I said the smoke smelled good to me. To say it smelled disgusting to me, someone who's enjoyed the smell since childhood thanks to my parents' addictions, would be lying. And you can say that, to have enjoyed the smell the month and a half into being a quitter indicates that I'm somehow failing. (You know, because I must have told myself to like the that smell on the way into the library on Saturday.) I don't want to tell my story just to have my honesty mocked. That's not what I'm here for and if that means I don't belong in this group, that's okay too.  

Emily it is not possible to enjoy cigarette smoke. No one is saying you need to recast childhood memories as negative if they include smoke. Also no one here will accept that cigarette smoke *truly is* enjoyable.

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@EmilyDarline. They aren't attacking you or your story. They're pointing out holes in your armor. I remember when I was about 50 days quit I finally was able to think about more than just surviving the next few hours without dip. For me the journey to real quit started when i started discovering how little dip did for me and much I pretended it did to justify my using. 

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Emily, I do not have an issue with you saying  cigarette smoke still smells amazing. You're 40 something days into a new life. Re-wiring the thought process takes time, but you need to start the process. At 40 days when I saw a friend dipping, there was a part of me that wanted to bum one, but the thought would infuriate me that I was still that weak. That a plant still had such a level of control over me. The next time, instead of dwelling on the amazing smell, think of what Randy mentioned..... money out of your purse, time away from loved ones.  That is what cigarette smoke truly smells like.

  Keep training your brain that anything related to nicotine is bad. Have the mentality of never again... burn your boats.  I promise in a short amount of time , walking through a cloud of cigarette smoke will be a disgusting endeavor.

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It legitimately smells like ass.  But assuming you liked that smell, which you really didn't,  you don't now.   Pretending to like cigarette smoke is the nicotine talking. We don't engage in conversations with nicotine here.

Continuing to threaten to take your ball and go home because we are correcting you,  yeah that's not working either.   

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Guys, I see what you're saying. Maybe the picture I'm painting of the incident is inaccurate. It did not even last long enough to have been dwelled on, although you may see my referencing and acknowledging it as dwelling. To me, acknowledging my weakness is holding myself accountable. I haven't been around that smell since I quit. Having such a strong, albeit fleeting, reaction did take me by surprise and reminded me just how much of a baby quitter I am. The point in even mentioning this was to point out the power of addiction. Yes, I call myself an addict and no, the victim status of my choices does not releive me of any responsibility. 

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Mitch, I'm not even going to respond to that other than to say I did no such thing. I don't want to waste anyone's time here if I don't fit into the mold, myself included. Just being mindful. 

 

And yes, I've liked the smell since as far back as I can remember, long before I was a smoker. It is what it is.

Edited by EmilyDarline

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Just now, EmilyDarline said:

Mitch, I'm not even going to respond to that other than to say I did no such thing. I don't want to waste anyone's time here if I don't fit into the mold, myself included. Just being mindful. 

Every time you mention leaving I'm talking to Nicotine again. 

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@Mitch McDeere If the group, as you do, sees my story as looking for an excuse to start up again, then it's not the group for me. But I think you're mostly, if not completely, alone in that viewpoint. I should be able to bring up my story w/o accusations of wanting to start up again. That's not accountability. If that were a common theme amongst everyone here, I would have been gone a day or two in.

Edited by EmilyDarline

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Stop looking for the perceived negatives typed out by others, and respond to the positives ... that's a good direction to take.  You fit in here just fine, but you also need correcting from time to time.  Take it for what it is ... it isn't an attack on you, it's an attack on the old you, the one that smoked.  You should've killed her by now, or at least beat her up a little.  We're here to help, and to reinforce the NEW version of Emily, not justify the reasoning of the OLD version of Emily.  Whether you realize it or not, it's the OLD version that's pushing back.  Search for the positives, ignore the negatives if it helps your quit.  Paying attention to the perceived negatives while ignoring the positives does very little for your quit.  

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8 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

@Mitch McDeere If the group, as you do, sees my story as looking for an excuse to start up again, then it's not the group for me. But I think you're mostly, if not completely, alone in that viewpoint. I should be able to bring up my story w/o accusations of wanting to start up again. That's not accountability. If that were a common theme amongst everyone here, I would have been gone a day or two in.

You are 100% WRONG! I quit with that man every single day and I will continue to do for the rest of my natural days. Mitch is QUIT.

You are NOT speaking quit! Get it through your head. Your story of being an active addict is over, do you understand that? NO one here wants to hear of how you "liked" that smell since as long as you can remember. When you talk like that, you are nicotine just as Mitch said. Rewire. Start reading here A LOT. You've got one foot through that threshold now.

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I'm just not going to lie to myself. The smoke smelled good to me. That is as true is it gets. I understand that it's not supposed to smell amazing, that's why I quit. Spinning it any other way would be lying to myself and the group. I concur, enjoying the smell is weakness in the armor. I did not make the decision, at that moment, to enjoy it. I was enjoying at before I even knew I was smelling it.

Acknowledging the power that "plant" had and still to a degree has on me is why I'm here. The plant does have power, which is why this group exists. If we could will that power away, why not just go roll in a patch of poison ivy and will away the rash? 

I get the idea that you guys are portraying, but pretending I didn't enjoy the smell sets me up for failure. Recognizing just how powerful the nicotine is keeps me from having "just one more". 

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31 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

@Mitch McDeere If the group, as you do, sees my story as looking for an excuse to start up again, then it's not the group for me. But I think you're mostly, if not completely, alone in that viewpoint. I should be able to bring up my story w/o accusations of wanting to start up again. That's not accountability. If that were a common theme amongst everyone here, I would have been gone a day or two in.

You are wrong. About all of this, Snowflake. 

And you have one foot out of the door already. You're looking for the excuse to leave. 

Edited by Mitch McDeere

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Well, you are wrong Mitch. I am not looking for an excuse to smoke, just recognizing my triggers so I can avoid them. Sorry if that doesn't fit into the mold or whatever. 

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I would not need an excuse to leave. 

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4 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

Well, you are wrong Mitch. I am not looking for an excuse to smoke, just recognizing my triggers so I can avoid them. Sorry if that doesn't fit into the mold or whatever. 

You are wrong.  I've seen you before and I will see you again.  Unfortunately, I probably won't be seeing this version much longer.

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5 minutes ago, EmilyDarline said:

I would not need an excuse to leave. 

No, you'd just need to smell some sweet cigarette smoke.  

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@Mitch McDeere thanks for your support. 

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45 minutes ago, Grady said:

This is probably the politest that I've ever seen Mitch treat a butterfly.

I don't want Sapper to pick on you again.

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1 hour ago, EmilyDarline said:

Acknowledging the power that "plant" had and still to a degree has on me is why I'm here.

I think your take on the level it has over you currently is the issue here, nothing more.  When the words amazing & alluring are typed out as adjectives, those are real, deeply embedded thoughts ... not fleeting.  

edit: every last time someone refers to their addiction using these words, we'll push their shit in.

Edited by 8meds

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The issues are:

(1) not that it smells good to her, but that she is revelling in it.

(2) that she keeps threatening to leave if we don't quit her way, instead of the other way around.

 

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21 minutes ago, 8meds said:

I think your take on the level it has over you currently is the issue here, nothing more.  When the words amazing & alluring are typed out as adjectives, those are real, deeply embedded thoughts ... not fleeting.  

edit: every last time someone refers to their addiction using these words, we'll push their shit in.

Noted, thanks for the clarification 8Meds. 

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21 minutes ago, 8meds said:

Edit: every last time someone refers to their addiction using these words, we'll push their shit in.

This.

There aren't a lot of smokers here. I dabbled during some of my stoppages or while trying to get laid or something... But I wasn't a smoker. 

I asked my lady this morning if she thought the smoke smelled good immediately after quittin' 8 years ago. "No, I thought they smelled like shit even when I was smoking"

But, to convert your romanticism to a currency more recognizable here.... Imagine a noob here spouting this nonsense...

"I enjoy being quit, but sometimes I see a spitter in my car, and I open it and the smell is so alluring I just want to gargle it" 

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